Curse

MithranArkanere · May 19, 2009, 03:56 PM // 15:56

With 'again' I meant 'later campaigns'.
Prophecies has lost of one-neemy mobs, but it's seems just plain lazyness or lack of resources.
In new campaigns, almost every single race had at least 3 different professions, in their ranks, with a few exceptions, but in Factions:
- All trolls are warriors.
- All dragons, imps and hydras are elementalists.
- Al griffon mobs are composed either of "all warrior" or "all monks".

Then there are some enemies thay may have as much as 2 professions in their groups, like gargoyles, grawl or elementals.

And the charr, the centaurs, the tengu, the stone summit, the undead, the white matle, the forgotten, the mursaat and the titans are few of the many enemies found in Prophecies that may have 3 or more professions in a group at the same time.

And it's not just professions, it's also builds.

Stone summit may have as much as 14 different builds in the Eye of North areas, while the Hydras have basically the same build in all their 3 different appearances.

I'd rather have groups of mixed professions with all the different appeaances they have for some creatures than different ppearances with the same profession several times in the game.

Red Sonya · May 19, 2009, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by anaiya

How lucky for us that you and people like you constitute < 1% of the playerbase.

We could give a shit.

What's that you say Anaiya? I can't hear you? Ohhhhhh that's right you are banned so you can't speak haha

At any rate how did you come up with < 1% of the player base? I love how people throw these figures out here like sheets in the wind without any proof or documentations just speculation. Well heck I can do that I'd say well over 50% prefer rare content over same ole same ole everybody has one or can get one mentality. See! Works for me also.

Bryant Again · May 19, 2009, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowerpoke

non insc = insta fail merch junk

I'd have to go with this feller here.

Ja, it's cool getting a totally rare and perfect Tyrian/Canthan skin, but that's not a terribly common event. I don't like looking at a cool skin, ID'ing it, and finding it useless. I'd much rather see a cool skin, ID it, and if the stats aren't good, be able to change it to my liking.

@Arcanemacabre: Hooooly cow I saw your post get quoted and I freaked! Welcome back!!!

MithranArkanere · May 20, 2009, 01:46 PM // 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Sonya

[...]
At any rate how did you come up with < 1% of the player base? I love how people throw these figures out here like sheets in the wind without any proof or documentations just speculation. Well heck I can do that I'd say well over 50% prefer rare content over same ole same ole everybody has one or can get one mentality. See! Works for me also.

And I assure you that at least 90% of the people consider more rare a new skin they have never seen than the same plain skin they have got already 30 times just because it has a 15 instead a 14, when they already can attach that 15 to that cool new skin with an inscription.

Rarity in skins is a rarity that you actually see when the item is equipped.
'Rarity' in properties is an 'unseen' rarity that is only shown if you go around opening trades with people or posting images in forums.
When you ping a weapon, it doesn't even show if the item is inscribed or not, se it should be more important to be able to modify the variable properties of that item than getting those variable properties maxed when it drops.
All items have at least two fixed properties that are not variable. With more skins in-game now, there is no need for more.

Those that ask for rarity should ask for things like more skins or making the rare skins drops less frequently, not to make more rare the occurrences of an item with maxed properties. Not in GW, where max is not something to long for, but to reach reasonably fast.

Ozric · May 20, 2009, 05:25 PM // 17:25

+1 for the old drop system. Between collectors, weapon shops and existing mods, we already had all we needed before inscriptions. Afterwards we lost a major source of fun in the game in searching for that perfect drop. All merchant food now, but what's done is done.

Zahr Dalsk · May 20, 2009, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Non-inscribable is pointless and retarded; I applaud ArenaNet for the addition of inscriptions.

Skyy High · May 20, 2009, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozric

+1 for the old drop system. Between collectors, weapon shops and existing mods, we already had all we needed before inscriptions. Afterwards we lost a major source of fun in the game in searching for that perfect drop. All merchant food now, but what's done is done.

It was all merchant food before the update. At least now if you get a nice skin, you have a chance of actually using it yourself. I didn't have a single non-collector weapon that I liked using before greens came out, because all the mods sucked on basically everything else. Similarly, I didn't have a single non-green weapon that I liked using before NF.

Zahr Dalsk · May 20, 2009, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozric

Afterwards we lost a major source of fun in the game in searching for that perfect drop.

That isn't fun; it's stressful and annoying. And no one's stopping you from continuing to do so in Factions and Prophecies.

Painbringer · May 20, 2009, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by belladonna shylock

Though you're not wrong, I see the opposite as you. I feel it's a million times more enjoyable to chest run (in my opinion) non-inscr. items because those items are truly rare. When you get an R9 with perfect mods it makes you want to run 200 more chests that day. The same is not true with EOTN and Nightfall chests.

In my opinion, nightfall and EOTN killed the "rare" find.

I second this opinion

The good old days where all items found where collectible even a crappy looking thing if it was maxed was an awesome find. The good old days when a + 20% sundering mod sold for 90-120k. It makes an ill feeling in my stomach when I see them traded for 3k. Inscriptions should be for collector weapons only IMO. Don’t get me wrong I like the inscriptions but I think drops and chests should drop with out them. Maybe make them salvageable but not upgradable. The value of rares would sky rocket.

glacialphoenix · May 20, 2009, 08:01 PM // 20:01

The problem with

Quote:

The good old days when a + 20% sundering mod sold for 90-120k.

is that not everyone can afford that 90-120k. Say you want to outfit a new character. Think about the amount of money you'd have to fork out to outfit that new character if you really wanted that +20% sundering mod.

If you happen to find lots of those sundering mods, they're probably 'good old days' for you. Not so much for the people who keep trying to find them but can't, and can't afford to fork out 90k. Yes?

(Although, boy, I remember being absolutely delighted to find a Sup Death Magic rune because it went for 7k at the time, and I was dead broke.)

Ozric · May 20, 2009, 08:39 PM // 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

That isn't fun; it's stressful and annoying. And no one's stopping you from continuing to do so in Factions and Prophecies.

Maybe it's not obvious enough to you, but the real fun in finding that perfect drop was the worth attached to it. With inscribables, that value is greatly diminished, as is the fun.

Stressful? Annoying? These aren't terms I'd usually associate with playing a game I enjoy. What kept you going all that time before inscriptions were available?

Zahr Dalsk · May 20, 2009, 08:53 PM // 20:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozric

Maybe it's not obvious enough to you, but the real fun in finding that perfect drop was the worth attached to it.

Those items are still there for you to hunt, if you really enjoy that

We get inscribables, you get trash, everyone's happy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozric

Stressful? Annoying? These aren't terms I'd usually associate with playing a game I enjoy. What kept you going all that time before inscriptions were available?

If all you did in Guild Wars was hunt items, I feel sorry for you.

UnChosen · May 20, 2009, 09:03 PM // 21:03

No, I hunt items while playing the game at top performance using COLLECTERS and CRAFTER items, and the items I get gives additional excitement to the missions/quests themselves. And after I finish all the missions I hunt items till the next chapter comes out. Now not only is all the missions repeated to death, there's absolutely nothing to look forward to in drops or chests.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

The problem with is that not everyone can afford that 90-120k. Say you want to outfit a new character. Think about the amount of money you'd have to fork out to outfit that new character if you really wanted that +20% sundering mod.

If you happen to find lots of those sundering mods, they're probably 'good old days' for you. Not so much for the people who keep trying to find them but can't, and can't afford to fork out 90k. Yes?

(Although, boy, I remember being absolutely delighted to find a Sup Death Magic rune because it went for 7k at the time, and I was dead broke.)

I actually don't mind mods being cheap at all, since I do believe in the skill>time concept so perfect items should be available for cheap. What I don't believe in is cosmetics>time where every crappy gold items became perfect and ruin the rarity of nearly all gold items. If people want perfect easily there are collectors and crafter items available, and the good looking ones should be earned.

Improvavel · May 20, 2009, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Inscriptions are great if what you want is freedom.

Non-inscriptions are great if you are lucky enough to get a rare one and want to grab someone else farming money to buy the non inscription rare weapon you want.

So, inscription system favor players while non-inscription system favor farmer/traders.

I'm a player I prefer the inscription system and want it to be implemented in all campaigns. If I was a farmer/trader I would rather have the opposite.

If what you want is a sephis axe or a claymore because you like the skin, inscriptions are great. If what you want is xxx skin that is the rarest because no one else has one, then you don't want inscriptions.

Yawgmoth · May 20, 2009, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Those that ask for rarity should ask for things like more skins or making the rare skins drops less frequently, not to make more rare the occurrences of an item with maxed properties. Not in GW, where max is not something to long for, but to reach reasonably fast.

Thanks for telling us what we should consider rare, but we won't agree.

When we're talking about usual drops found while playing the campagins or chestrunning - skin itself is nothing. Skin + Stats combination is the real rarity, or in some cases it's just stats!

As a fan of rarities I'd love to see MORE functional variety among items (trust me, there are ways to do that without impacting game balance). I don't want more skins as there are way too many in GW compared to their functional variety, effecting in every new one being just *more of the same* - If I already got one I like more there's no point in getting interested in the new ones.

Inscribable items are so lame and not worthy of collecting for the simple reason they're all practically the same, zero variety. They're all perfectly usable, but at the same time hold no value as 'treasures', no fun of collecting xeros. That's why I love getting *ORIGINAL* rares in Tyria and Cantha.

Lest121 · May 20, 2009, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Sonya

Personally I wish they would take all the inscriptions out and players have to go back to playing the way it was in the beginning. Nothing screwed up the game more than open inscriptions and that zashien chest droppings. Nobody has to work for nothing anymore in this game it's handed to you like candy. But, I have since been calling this game Candyland so I guess it truely fits now.

You sound like the the typical greedy player who wants all the items to remain rare and at a high price.........I love Guildwars for the fact that most of the weapons are very, very common.

UnChosen · May 20, 2009, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by underverse_ninja

You sound like the the typical greedy player who wants all the items to remain rare and at a high price.........I love Guildwars for the fact that most of the weapons are very, very common.

I want some items to remain rare and at a high price, which I don't find unreasonable at all. I also want some items that are medium in rarity, and some common ones....its called variety.

Too bad the damage is already done, all random dropped gold are pretty much worthless, and the only ones that still worth something are those that are obtained after some stressful dungeon's chest, and even those can be counted with 2 hands.

All I hope is that Anet add something to spice things up, like craftable weapons in FoW for 1000 ectos each or something.

MithranArkanere · May 20, 2009, 11:43 PM // 23:43

Well, the 100k limit in trades is there for a reason.
I doubt they ever intended so many items to be sold over 100k like when there were no inscriptions. The price of some green item was just insane.
Inscriptions and HM changed that, and the average rare item cost is around 50k now, while there are still stuff over 100k. That was a success.

It is the skin what should have a limited availability, not a set of properties for an item. Not in GW. Yeah, people may like that, but that's not GW-like.
Look at PvP tournament rewards. That's the perfect example. Getting the prestige skins is the hard thing. Getting the properties is as easy as it should be.
There are other games with more levels and with a better item always waiting after some more kills. Examples are Diablo, Dungeon Siege or Dungeon Runners.
You can't press that kind of dropping system to GWO. Maybe for GW2, I don't know how will it bem but as GW is now. It just doesn't make sense.

In those games you just add stuff on top of what you have. You add more attributes, you get more health, you get more armor... there are limits, but waaaay far from the start.
But GW is a game that has very limited equipment properties, attributes and skills while fighting.
That's why it is meaningless to keep the old system now that there are so many skins.
Yes, people may do want that kind of drop system, but it's not for GW, that's why the new one was added. I love that kind of drop system, but I want to keep it where it should be: games with hack and slash like Diablo.
The main and more strong reason to update the whole drops, it's the discrepancy with PvP items, the same reason why the Menagerie is good for PvP characters.
The differences between hearty and dire animals may not be so much, but they existed, and PvP-only characters never had a choice to go for those combinations.
Now they can, and that's good, and anyone saying otherwise... well, they would be just lying, and you know that!

The old system creates items PvP-characters can never create. If they want them, they must buy them, and if the item creation panel exists is so PvP characters doesn't have to buy anything, and one of the main reasons to get a PvP account and/or make PvP characters.
That incongruence must be fixed, either by adding more upgrades to allow all combinations that the old system created or by upgrading all old items to the new system.
Not much people would like the latter, so the first one is the logical solution.

There would be still the problem of the old drops not bing inscribable. Although I think It would be just easier to update everything like with armors, I see more pressing to allow PvP-only characters to have any set of properties a PvE can bring...

...well, excepting PvP-only stuff like infusion, of course.

And remember that [reverb]Inscriptions don't make items drop with perfect properties[/reverb], and even with perfect upgrades you can't always make them perfect. They just allow to change one variable property that was previously fixed to add more rarity when there were less variety in skins.
Now that there are so many different skins, that 'extra' rarity is no longer needed! The base properties is enough.
Inscriptions don't make items gold+max base+req9, it is Hard Mode what makes that more common, not inscriptions, and farming builds make the rest.

Improvavel · May 21, 2009, 12:03 AM // 00:03

A typical example of the "Market player" vs the "Kill mobs player".

"Market players" would be doomed if the "Kill mobs players" could get all the stuff they need.

The inscription system is superior for the "kill mobs player" since they can get the stuff they want to kill the mobs in a more efficient way much faster.

Now "market players" don't need multiple weapons to kill mobs faster. If they kill mobs at all is by farming and that depends much more on skills than weapons and when farming they are alone so who cares if they are using crappy collector weapons? They only need a lucky drop or make some initial money by farming or power trading and from then on they can play "market wars".

Due to the very "greedy" nature of GW concerning loot back then (and still now) the "market/farmer players" would acquire quite an advantage over the "kill mobs player".

UnChosen · May 21, 2009, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Collectors + Crafter = No advantage for "market players"

Its not like we can charm the monsters with dazzling good looks or something.